Monday, March 2, 2015

In criticism of the straddle rule

TBC, who many of you may be familiar with, was asking about my opinions on the live straddle in the comment section from a prior post.  As I was writing my response, I realized that I've always disliked the straddle rule, but never truly laid out my thoughts as to why I dislike the rule.  Therefore, I figured I capture my thoughts in a post.

There are 2 types of straddles that I'm familiar with: the UTG straddle and the Mississippi straddle.  It serves that I should explain the differences between the two, and how, in fact, a straddle in poker terms, is defined.
  • A straddle is an optional blind bet, where the player, acting as a an additional blind (next to the small blind & big blind), places a bet double or greater than the big blind amount.  It is in effect a blind raise, but action begins with the player immediately to the left of the straddler and closes with the straddler who may check (facing limps around the board), raise, or fold (given a prior raise).
  • The standard straddle rule allows fro the straddler to place a straddle from the UTG position, forcing UTG+1 to act first.  Action will close with the UTG position - the small & big blinds can call the straddle bet or fold prior to action closing with the straddler.
  • The Mississippi straddle allows the straddler to place a straddle from any position, save for the small & big blinds.  Therefore, one could straddle from the UTG position as above, or straddle from the BTN which forces the first action on the small blind.

All things being equal, there is no inherent advantage to a straddle since all positions / players have the same equal opportunity based on the straddle rules - i.e. straddle is open to all players who opt to do it.  The inherent purpose of a straddle is to add action to the game; i.e. it forces any callers to call for >=2x BB, adding money to the pot, in turn making the pot worth more to fight over.

--- Opinion ---

Generally, I believe that the standard straddle is a waste - you're buying closing action for 2xBB (or more, which is a greater waste) for the PF round.  Thereafter, you're going to have to work from presumably terrible position as the UTG - save for the exception of if all positions fold and the blinds are the only callers.  That said, since the pots are double where they would normally be sized, I think the person employing the straddle should be raising with increased regularity (greater range) over the non-straddled hands - and in my myopic data points, the straddlers usually do.  There are a few thoughts that I have with regard to increasing the raising frequency from the straddle's position:
  • The raise should be sized much larger than a normal raise; after all the pots are double as larger, perhaps a double-sized raise is in order.  For example, in a 1/2 game with a $4 straddle, if there are 4 limpers, the pot is ~$16-20, where it would normally be $8-10 without the straddle.  Therefore, a straddler's raise should be in the range of $25-30, whereby the non-straddle's raise sizing should be in the range of $12-15.  That's a healthy difference, as most players know that set mining becomes less and less profitable the more north of 10% full stacks they go (i.e. given a full $200 stack, $25-30 is about 15% effective stacks).
  • Again, given my myopic data points, I've seen a ton of raising out of the straddle positions, and given a large enough raise, the straddler usually folds out the action and scoops a decent pot.  In other words, players at low stakes live poker tend to overestimate the value of limping a straddle pot, and tend to fold to the "unexpected" resistance / raise.  A 2BB mistake for each player adds up to a lot of money for the straddler to use to his advantage when he scoops.
  • Following on the point above, if a known straddler regularly raises, then the non-straddling players should consider limping their big hands with the expectation to limp / raise.  They could do this with bluffs as well, since the straddler is unlikely to be strong given his past history.
That said, I believe standard straddles have their time & place to wield as a tool to your advantage. For example, if you find yourself at a table full of tight / passive players, a straddle could serve to open up the game.  Players get frustrated throwing in a straddle limp only to get raised off their limped hands.  Frustration generally leads to poor play.

Personally, I tend to approach straddle hands with a sharper eye.  I tighten my range, realizing that the limping range should be smaller and be able to withstand a healthy raise.  I should have a purpose for calling with the expectation that not only the straddler may raise, but also any other position may raise.  Therefore, I tend to drop the "dominated hands" out of my range (KT, QT, etc.) for fear of the pending raise.

FWIW, only once have I tried the limp / re-raise move - it did indeed work - but it definitely got my heart rate up (I had KQ if I recall correctly, and I'm not sure whether it wound up with me shoving a blank flop as a bluff).  It's definitely outside of my comfort zone, but I would try it again when an opportunity presents itself, i.e. a habitual straddler always raising on the closing action.

Another point about straddles, it doubles the stakes of the table. Essentially, it makes the BB 2x or more. Therefore, if there's a straddle, each player must "limp" the new BB size (or raise in increments of the new BB size) - reducing full stacks (originally 100 BB) to 50 BB. Realizing that fact, you're not playing nearly as deep as you were prior to the straddle - and it makes the table a lot more costly to play. I believe a professional's advantage lies the deeper the stacks are - the straddle shifts the advantage more in favor of the worse players. Look, it comes down to this: I sit down at a 1/2 or 1/3 table and want to play those stakes. If it's going up to a 1 / 3 / 6 table, then I may as well switch over to 2/5.

Most of the above applies to the standard straddle, but can be applied to the Mississippi straddle.  However, it should be pointed out that for the Mississippi straddle, the clear advantage is straddling the BTN and other late positions.  As a smart player, you need to do the same to even the advantage out.  In other words, a BTN straddle takes away the PF advantage of blinds acting last, forcing them to put dead money in the pot and act immediately to complete the dead money or fold with terrible position from that point forward.  If you're losing your BB ability to act last, then you need to gain that ability back by straddling the BTN yourself.

FWIW, when the Mississippi straddle is allowed where I'm playing, unless others are opting for it, I generally try to avoid the topic altogether.  I feel like if I start doing it (something I'd like to do - straddle the BTN & CO), then I'm encouraging others to do it.  All of a sudden, the price of poker just went up and I'm playing a 1 / 3 / 6 or 1 / 2 / 4 game with 50BB stacks when I should just play 2/5.  I don't think I've ever standard straddled - I don't think I've ever played in a game that tight where I feel it warranted - and if I were in that kind of game, I'd get up & change tables!

19 comments:

  1. I don't mind MS straddles - they loosen up the game, as you point out. But I do hate when only one or two players do it and they do it when I'm in one of the blinds. Now I have to act first AND put money into the pot, a bad situation.

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    1. @MOJO - yes; I hate putting out the BB only to have to fold it immediately because I have a bad hand. It's such a waste, putting in the BB and then having to add another BB just to call.

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  2. this post dont address the real issue in the RTP arguement with stealthmunk though. its the fact a guy can MS straddle continuously, and if u are on his left, u will always be acting first all the time about.

    see MOJO agrees with me that the blinds dont benefit from this. stealthmunk was trying to make the arguement everyone but the straddler benefits (in a full ring game, not one where the button is straddling SHORTHANDeD). i was trying to make the argument that its not just the straddler wasting his money--hes wasting the blinds money also and costing them extra. and the poker meister seems to agree, it does NOT help the blinds.

    i also am arguing its not only the blinds that get screwed this way--its also anyone UTG who must act a lot in more standard MS straddles where the guy immediately after the straddle isnt one of the blinds.

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    1. Tony, in a MS straddle game, everyone needs to straddle, making it a zero sum gain. If everyone straddles equally, then every position has the same ad/disadvantage.

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  3. I think tony just doesn't understand what unethical means- stealthmunk

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  4. Looks like I'm going to be the odd one out here. I love the Mississippi straddle as it accomplishes s awesome things:

    1) Increase Profit. I'm going to assume anyone reading The Poker Meister's blog understands that they win the highest % of hands from the button. In a vacuum, this is the only argument necessary. If you win the most amount of hands from a certain position, you want the pot to be the largest possible from inception.

    2) Enhance Image. Come on people we're talking about a 1/2 or 1/3 game. People perceive straddles as maniacs at this level. Where as at 2/5 or 5/10 nobody is ever going to be intimidated or comment on a straddle. Straddling at this level wins you pure image points.

    3) Increase Edge. Also, don't think that you straddling will trigger others to do so or suddenly give up your edge. Don't you want to play a higher stakes game against lower stakes players? Do you think they will be able to adjust to you the same way that you can adjust to the reduction in effective stacks?

    I love straddling the button and the only reason why I wouldn't is if I fear that it will negatively affect an otherwise good game.

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    1. @josh - Good comments. I agree with all of your points, save for #3. I think it decreases your edge. When the pot becomes larger and BB decrease (i.e. playing a 100BB vs. a 50BB effective stack), your edge goes down. The deeper your stacks, the more edge you have / the more playing room you have with bet sizing / playing the odds.

      FWIW, I've played twice at the 'Shoe, where they have the MS straddle, and a handful of times at Delaware Park. I have yet to straddle Baltimore - and the only time I straddle is on the BTN when other players are straddling as well. I'll straddle for fairness, not for an edge, because I generally don't want to upset the apple cart at these games. Straddling serves to piss people off usually.

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    2. PM, if you agree with point #1, then you must in some ways agree with point #3, depending on how you measure edge. In absolute $ terms, #3 must be true if #1 is true. In relative terms, #3 may or may not be true if #1 is true.

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    3. so then PM i take it u arent a fan of the Kill or 1/2 Kill poker in Omaha/Hold em????

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    4. Isn't the kill pot in limit holdem / omaha?

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    5. I've never played kill pot, so not a clue whether it would be cool or not... but I'd imagine I would not like a forced raise bet blind.

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  5. everyone cannot straddle every hand. in practice ur theory claims all 9 people should straddle every time they arent the BB or sb which is impossible.

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  6. but since straddling is stupid and dumb, this is just u showing ur ignorance when u think this way (that i should do it too). the real issue is the unfairness of being on the wrong side of a habitual straddler

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    1. First of all, Tony, why is it impossible for all players to BTN straddle? It is obviously their choice, but there is nothing stopping them. In fact, if they do so, it changes the game slightly, but it also evens the playing field - i.e. no net gain from straddling since everyone has the same opportunity at the same position. All it's doing is effectively adding another blind position that acts last. The reality is, Tony, that you're adding money to the pot which increases the overall pot size. Your wins will be much larger on straddle pots than ordinary non-straddled pots. If money weren't such an issue for you, perhaps you'd view the straddle differently, because to a professional player, it should be a non issue.

      The real issue is not the unfairness, but the fact that you don't take advantage of the straddle when it's your turn - for fear of having to put out even more money than the blinds.

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    2. Tony, you forgot about an important counter measure, it is called a seat change.

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    3. By the way, I love seating to the right of a button straddle. I get the advantage of 2nd last to act throughout the hand, in a bigger pot, without having to commit any money before looking at my hand.

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  7. Excellent, well thought out post, PM!

    Yes -- one of the really bad feelings when playing $1/2 NL poker is having a player who straddles every orbit on your big blind. Time to switch seats or tables if at all possible.

    And yes -- tighten up when someone regularly acts last on a straddle and raises. This is one of the times when short stacking can be better. You can always push and take your chances without losing afew hundo.

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  8. LOL @ Tony. What a fish you are. Your inability to adjust to game/table dynamics is your problem. Sure the left of a habitual straddler can be an annoying seat. It doesn't mean you are screwed though if you understand how to react to it. Limp less, open raise mostly, play a tighter range, hell even mix in some limp/rr if you see the opportunity to. Someone putting 2BB voluntarily every hand blind is a GOOD thing for the table. This is ~55-60BB being put in the pot per hour. It is beyond me that anyone can ever think this is a bad thing. Also it is only "bad" preflop.

    Couple other points: as dogg said if you sit to the right of the chronic straddler you can open up your game and raising ranges pretty much at will. Also if you simply are incapable of adjusting to the table dynamic, simply request a seat change.

    You will do none of these because you are not a good poker player.

    ReplyDelete

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